Iconic Worship's Vivian Williams Interview Throwback Snippet - Encountering GOD | John Giftah Podcast

0:01 Speaker 1: Do you ever look around and think, wow, the world is a crazy place, and it just seems to get crazier and crazier? Ease your mind and take a break. This is Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta. We're a hub for inspirational Christian sermons, practical keys for Christian living and Christian discussions and interviews. You'll be inspired to live the life that you were created for. Your host is a top ranking podcaster, bestselling author, world record holder, aerospace engineer, life coach, evangelist and founder of John Gifta International.

0:41 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta.

0:49 Speaker 2: Hey everybody, it's such a joy for me to be with all of you today. And it's such a joy that after a long break, I'm back into the interviewing scene. And I'm so excited to have with us today, Vivian, who is the founder of Iconic Worship and the moment that is just making such amazing waves across the Christian world. I'm so happy that you're with us today, Vivian.

1:13 Speaker 3: Thank you, John. It's a pleasure to be here.

1:14 Speaker 4: I've been watching you on YouTube and Instagram for so long. And when I met you at MJJ Church, I didn't know you go to that church, but it's a pleasure to be watching your videos, to be finally sitting in your video.

1:28 Speaker 5: Thank you so much.

1:29 Speaker 2: And I'm also so grateful to have you, especially, you know, restarting this whole interviewing scene and that to start it with you is such an awesome thing. And I always been dreaming every time I come to Iconic Worship.

1:42 Speaker 5: Guys, I always say this, right?

1:45 Speaker 2: You know, the best things in the world are always like you have an iPhone or an iPad. And when it comes to the best part of worship is iconic. So, you know, it's really amazing. I'm not just making this up. I couldn't come very frequently because of my tight schedule. But every time I came. whether it's three or four times, it's always been such a blessing. Guys, I really recommend you to check it out. I think you guys are traveling across the globe doing these sessions and I want you to be plugged into it.

2:13 Speaker 5: And it's amazing, right?

2:16 Speaker 2: Even though this is the first time we're sitting together and talking, like this uh i don't know i've not shared this with you but there were so many times or very regularly i'm led by god to specifically pray for you i've been praying for you for i don't know ever since i got to know you i think i had the privilege of attending your very first iconic.

2:34 Speaker 6: Worship iconic one yes in nagawara i remember you you had come i still remember that when we were just We just started off with the first iconic.

2:46 Speaker 5: Yes, yes, yes.

2:47 Speaker 2: So they always say, you know, the first impression is the best impression. So it's so good to have you. And at the same time, you know, there's so many people you.

2:57 Speaker 5: Get to know.

2:58 Speaker 2: Oh, this is Vivian and you're doing this iconic worship. But why don't you give a little introduction about yourself in a way that I always believe the best introduction is self-introduction.

3:09 Speaker 4: Oh, I'm the founder of Iconic Worship. It's a worship movement across Bangalore. We come from different churches and we worship in these open spaces usually. But now we've been shifting to closed-door spaces because of better sound quality and because of those reasons. But our aim is to unite churches. Our aim is to bring young people together. Forget our differences. Forget our theological differences because we have more than 45,000 denominations, right? So if you say that, okay, I'm going to check my theology before worshiping together, you'll be worshiping alone or forever.

3:46 Speaker 5: Yes. It's true.

3:48 Speaker 4: My motto is that, okay, you love Jesus, we love Jesus, let's worship him together. So that's the heart of what we're doing at Iconic Worship. And yeah, myself, a small gist, I never wanted to get into this ministry scene where we were, I want to probably think about it after the age of 50. I used to be a founder of a company called Swift Ride.

4:15 Speaker 5: Okay.

4:16 Speaker 4: That was a car and bike pulling app for college students.

4:19 Speaker 5: Oh, nice.

4:20 Speaker 4: And, you know, in two years time, we got a lot of success. We were part of the Google Startup Bootcamp, 2022 batch, Microsoft Founders Hub. And we also went to the final round of Shark Tank. For some reasons, we couldn't make it. We were part of the Cisco Thinky Beta. And we were supposed to go to Silicon Valley, Draper University, San Francisco. We were selected out of 2000 teams in India. And Elon Musk was a trainer in that institute.

4:48 Speaker 5: Oh, wow.

4:49 Speaker 4: All of these things. And that took a small pause. I'm out here building this. That's the background of what I am and what Iconic Worship is.

4:59 Speaker 5: That's so good. That's so good.

5:01 Speaker 2: I love how you talked about, you know, Iconic Worship is all about like, irrespective of our denominational beliefs, You know, I was just talking to somebody this morning and I was just saying this, that, you know, God is not going to say, oh, you know what, because of this small difference in our doctrinal opinion, you know, you're going to. stay in hell. You're not going to make it to heaven. You know, it's because we will have differences, right? Like for me, I consider myself like a mixed breed.

5:30 Speaker 2: I'm part of a Methodist church. I also attend an AD church. My ministry is non-denominational. I am exposed to different denominations and even in my ministry, people of different denominations follow my content. And, you know, if you're sometimes looking at like the smallest of doctrinal differences, we're going to miss out on the big picture.

5:49 Speaker 3: Absolutely.

5:50 Speaker 5: Because I've interviewed.

5:52 Speaker 2: Lots of people, including an Hollywood actress who has her own ministry as well. She's part of many of the Disney shows and all of these things. And likewise, I don't know if you've heard of something called Mark Angel Comedy. It's a very famous comedy from Africa.

6:08 Speaker 3: Yeah.

6:08 Speaker 2: One of the lead actors from Mark Angel Comedy based in, he saw my content once and started following me. And I was like, oh my gosh, I follow this guy. And we connected. And so, you know, when you start connecting with people like that, who are also loving the Lord and who are using their unique spaces to reach out to people, I just feel like, you know, if we are going to limit what God wants to do just because of doctrinal differences, we are missing out on the big picture of reaching the lost.

6:37 Speaker 3: Absolutely.

6:38 Speaker 2: And I just so love that, you know, we are, going into that pace of being interdenominational reaching people and and it's amazing you were saying that you you're this brainy guy you know you're doing so many things like this and i think there was a moment you encountered god right like god uh met you was it through a vision or an encounter what was that all about so i.

7:01 Speaker 4: Was um 12 years old and i just told i remember there was a fasting prayer from my church okay i.

7:08 Speaker 3: Couldn't go there because it was uh Raining. When I was 12 years old. So, basically, 2013, 2012, 2013. Okay.

7:21 Speaker 4: And we were in the fasting prayer. We watched it online. So, back in 2012, we had internet at our place.

7:30 Speaker 3: We watched it online.

7:32 Speaker 4: And that's when a lot of people who were present at the church were like, you know, I saw the feet of Jesus.

7:39 Speaker 3: I saw.

7:41 Speaker 4: I saw the robe of Jesus and immediately took off my sandals and all of these things. And I was like, God, like, you know, I don't want these feet, robe, and I want the entire body.

7:53 Speaker 3: I want to see you face to face.

7:55 Speaker 2: Wow.

7:55 Speaker 3: I want to see you face to face.

7:56 Speaker 4: And I remember, I told God, I was not, I'm not desperate for anything in life. The most desperate I've been is for a bicycle. But I'm more desperate for you. And I want to, I want to see you. And, uh, Pastor just came and he said, okay, cool. I'm going to close the fasting prayer. Then I got a man and God. I'm like, I have a bone to pick with you. I'm such a young kid and this will disappoint me. I have a bone to pick with you. I'm so mad at you. Because I've been so desperately asking to see you.

8:27 Speaker 4: And that's when pastor was like, no, I want to go for longer.

8:33 Speaker 3: Immediately it was just like, I want to go for longer. Okay. And then that's when I had a vision of Jesus. Okay. Okay, and that's a long vision.

8:41 Speaker 4: But basically, in the gist of the vision was, Vivian, where is your faith? So that's when I realized, yes, God loves desperation from us in certain aspects because we forget about everything else and just focus on Him.

8:58 Speaker 2: Yeah.

8:58 Speaker 4: But sometimes desperation just doesn't cut it. You require faith as well.

9:02 Speaker 2: Yes.

9:03 Speaker 3: Right. So, yeah, that was the encounter I had. Yeah. Within two days, I got baptized.

9:09 Speaker 5: Oh, that's so good. That's so good.

9:11 Speaker 2: A couple of things that we just talked about was like, you had your first encounter when you were at the age of 12.

9:16 Speaker 5: Yeah.

9:18 Speaker 2: My encounter with God was at the age of 11. Like, all was very similar. And mine was at Benningham's Crusade. Then you're the senior then, one year senior.

9:27 Speaker 4: Yes, yes.

9:27 Speaker 1: The people of Bangalore, India, do you want the free offer of Jesus Christ?

9:34 Speaker 2: It was at Pastor Benny Hinn's huge crusade in Bangalore.

9:37 Speaker 4: I think I saw a photo of you holding a ticket to that.

9:42 Speaker 3: Yes, I do. I think you posted it on Instagram, right?

9:45 Speaker 5: Yes, I did. 2005, January 21, 22, 23. I'll never forget that.

9:51 Speaker 2: That was the first time I encountered the Lord. Like I'm from a background like where many people don't believe in the gifts of the spirit or the anointing. There's not much of importance or there's a lot of ignorance. And many of them actually don't even believe in those things. According to many of them are sessionists. I don't know if you've heard those terminologies. So sessionists are those who believe that the gifts of the spirit sees in the Bible times. They don't exist anymore. So I didn't have that kind of an upbringing where I've seen miracles or I was like, you know, somebody else is of a different fate.

10:25 Speaker 5: I'm of this fate. That's all I would think of.

10:28 Speaker 2: But when I saw like miracles in front of me as 11 year old kid and seeing the impact, seeing that, oh my gosh, Jesus, you're real. Because before that, the only reason I allowed going to church was the chocolate cakes at the end of the service.

10:42 Speaker 5: Nothing else.

10:43 Speaker 2: But after seeing the reality of God and that's where I, I didn't understand much because I was just 11 years old. But I, you know, like experienced the power of the Holy Spirit, like a fire on me, like a huge warmth, something like I didn't understand what was going on. And Pastor Benny was saying, you know, some of your experiencing that's from the Holy Spirit. And that's when I experienced the touch of the Holy Spirit, like electricity flowing through me. And in that crusade, I said, Lord, I didn't know you were so real.

11:14 Speaker 2: I want you to use me like this to tell others about you. And now I see that translated into my life as I travel and preach. And that's been my heart. The ministry's name is John Gift International. You know, even I called it international on the first day of starting the ministry, even when it was not international. But that was what faith was all about. And now after 13 years of starting the ministry, I had my first international.

11:43 Speaker 5: Preaching opportunity earlier this year.

11:46 Speaker 2: So I always tell people, you know, you never know like one encounter where it's going to lead you.

11:51 Speaker 5: And you were desperate for that, right? At that moment.

11:54 Speaker 2: And one more thing the Lord put in my heart is, you know, God doesn't just give you encounters for you to talk about it, but he gives you the encounters so that you will do something about it. A lot of times we want encounters only so that, you know, I had an encounter, like even I've had encounters, like the Lord took me and showed me glimpses of hell three times. Those were like very scary encounters. There were encounters where I've seen miracles, so many people getting healed and all of that.

12:23 Speaker 2: But it's not something I just want to talk about. Yeah, I've seen hell, you know, and stuff like that. But I want that should translate into my life to.

12:31 Speaker 5: Say, you know what?

12:31 Speaker 2: I don't want people going to hell. That's why I'm doing what I'm doing because I have a full-time job. I have a lot of opposition for doing what I'm doing, but I'm still paying the price to do this because of that. So I think sometimes that's the thing that we need to have about encounters. Like, God, I'm desperate for you, but not just desperate for the encounter.

12:55 Speaker 3: So.

12:56 Speaker 2: So, but how did this translate into your life? Like you got baptized, but how did that translate into your walk with God?

13:04 Speaker 4: Yeah, funny enough, after six months of that happening, close to one year of that happening, I became an atheist.

13:13 Speaker 2: Oh my goodness. Okay, we'll hold it right there. You became an atheist after one year of becoming... After encountering the Lord.

13:21 Speaker 3: Around that time. Okay.

13:22 Speaker 2: Before we go to this part, this is so interesting, but I want to ask this question though. Like, a lot of times people say, you know, God encounters only the big people like Benny Hinn or someone like that. What is your message on how God actually encounters even the young people? God encountered me, God encountered you while you were still young.

13:40 Speaker 3: I think God is.

13:42 Speaker 4: searching for those who are desperate and those who have faith that's the that's the answer you know I don't think there is any what do you say selective encounters but like you told after every encounter something is born you know you can't just keep the encounter to yourself and just talk about it or post some story about it reel about it and yeah forget about it something has to be born because an encounter has a reason and probably you might not see it at that time but there is a reason because in the encounter itself i had seen a vision of me uh preaching to millions of people wow wearing a coat on a suit so that encountered carried even the plan okay cool i've met you but uh you know it's like how these big uh let's say if a politician comes to meet you he doesn't come to meet you or a let's say a big businessman says i want to meet john he doesn't come and says hi john drink a coffee and go off true you gotta have a plan like okay why is he meeting john okay probably wants to do some business in banglore probably wants to open a restaurant wants to open a cafe do something with you that's why he's taking his time flying from a different country coming and meeting you so that's true for um

15:07 Speaker 4: It's a human.

15:08 Speaker 3: How much more true it's for God.

15:10 Speaker 4: If God is coming and meeting you, you're just not coming to, okay, hi, how are you? Give you some shock electricity and some rainbow stories and okay, bye-bye.

15:17 Speaker 3: See you. Nice meeting.

15:19 Speaker 4: You know, there's a reason and the purpose why he encounters us. So, so yeah, I think, um, Anyone can get an encounter from God. And the secret is being desperate and having faith. Because for a long time, I thought it was desperation. Actually, very recently, when I was telling my testimony about the vision, is when I realized, okay, it is not just desperation, but also faith.

15:40 Speaker 5: Yes.

15:41 Speaker 3: Some people are very desperate, but they don't have faith. Some people have faith, but they're not desperate enough. They're not desperate. Okay, I have faith. Like an arrogant faith.

15:53 Speaker 4: In some cases, it works and some places, it is good to have that arrogant, stubborn faith.

15:58 Speaker 3: It's good.

15:59 Speaker 4: But I think with encounter with God, you need to have the desperate faith.

16:04 Speaker 3: So, yeah.

16:05 Speaker 5: That's so true.

16:06 Speaker 2: I was just reminded, like when you were sharing, like when you meet with a business person and this was a revelation that God actually gave me on a very similar line.

16:15 Speaker 5: Like when Joseph met the, what is his name? The Pharaoh, right?

16:20 Speaker 2: Yeah. When Joseph met the Pharaoh, it's not like, Oh, you met the Pharaoh and then you walk out the same. You know, when you meet a king, an earthly king, you're not going to walk out the same. Then what is your guarantee that when you meet the king of kings, you're not going to walk out the same. There will be a mandate. There will be a transformation. There will be a change that will translate into your life to be a greater blessing to other people. And that is something that we really, really need to like emphasize on, like, you know, when it comes to this, because a lot of times people like, like in very similar lines, right.

16:55 Speaker 2: I think there was a moment when, I don't know if you heard of Shaiju Matthew. Yeah. So when he had come to Karenia while I was in the second year or first year in college, while I'm in this, one of these meetings, I just look up and I sense angels on one particular side of the, place and this I'm just like are you sure God is this you is this are these real angels or am I just hallucinating and just two minutes later Saitamati turns to the same direction and he says there are angels in that same place So it's an act of, like you said, you know, that desperation, like, God, I want to encounter you.

17:36 Speaker 2: But at the same time, having the faith to say, you know what? Yes, I believe this is an angelic thing, you know? And the next minute, I remember once I met with somebody and I went to pray for someone in their house. And then I just turn and then I see in the vision, like, you know, an angel in a particular place. And I just took the step of faith and said, I see an angel in this place next to a window. And then they said, this is like a confirmation for us for God's protection because some robbers were trying through that very same window just two days before that trying to rob their house.

18:13 Speaker 2: So that's like a way God says that, you know, there is the desperation, but you take the slip of faith and then you see that this was of God.

18:23 Speaker 5: You know what I mean?

18:24 Speaker 2: So coming back to this aspect, you said that you just, encountered God but within a year became an atheist um I don't know if you've heard of this movie series it's basically based on a book it's called the perfect stranger uh the second part of it is called the another perfect stranger it's so beautiful maybe I'll share that with you it's one of my favorites so it's basically how Jesus meets uh with a lady uh she's an atheist Jesus meets with the lady, has dinner with her and her life is changed completely.

18:56 Speaker 2: And then the second part is about her daughter encountering Jesus, where she's an atheist because she's like, what is this? My mom is so crazy. She met with Jesus. But Jesus meets with her in the plane itself. And then comes the third part where that mom who initially encountered Jesus starts doubting because things have just faded away.

19:21 Speaker 5: You know what I mean?

19:21 Speaker 2: Like the minute you said that you encountered the Lord, but still you turned out into the direction of atheism. Like it's really something, it's not something like people on the outside will be like, Hey, you know what? How dare you? Like, you're so stupid. You're, you know, how could you be so blinded? But what do you think with some factors that took you in that direction? I'll just tell you why I'm asking this question right now. Those who are watching may be saying, you know, I'm strong in God.

19:49 Speaker 2: I've encountered God. but what if they are taking some steps or they're making some mistakes which could lead them in the same path as what led you.

20:02 Speaker 4: See the thing is I would like to compare this to people winning the lottery okay let's say your Income is this.

20:12 Speaker 3: All your life.

20:12 Speaker 4: Your income is like this... Okay... And suddenly you... Win the lottery... And your income is like this... Nineteen... Eight percent of lottery winners... Become bankrupt... Oh.

20:23 Speaker 3: Okay... Yeah... Most of them.

20:25 Speaker 4: Getting bankrupt... Then again... Have a fall... Because there was no growth to it... Compared to people who... Gotten wealth through... Running a business... You know... Every step of the way... They will learn to sustain... the money they know how to manage money so they don't see that fall usually but over here it's.

20:48 Speaker 3: It happens in a second.

20:49 Speaker 4: Similarly the logical reason why people who experience this especially me 12 years of my life zero encounters with God and one day a huge encounter but that encounter was not followed with what do you say maintaining a relationship with them I tried my best you know here and there I tried but I failed To an extent where I started to doubt everything.

21:12 Speaker 3: Was it really my imagination? Was it this? Was it that?

21:16 Speaker 4: And I started reading a lot of these books on philosophy, on nihilism. And yeah, I became, I believe that nihilism basically, that entire concept of, even if God exists, there is no point.

21:34 Speaker 5: Okay, okay.

21:36 Speaker 3: It's worse than easy. Okay, let's imagine if God exists. Off the front.

21:40 Speaker 4: So, we have those philosophies and... Yeah, I started doubting everything. So, my extreme belief, extreme disbelief had gone. And one of the reasons is because I didn't have a habit and a routine to handle that kind of divine encounter.

22:00 Speaker 3: You know, within myself. Didn't know how to handle it. So....

22:06 Speaker 4: Yeah, because of that, that's the main reason it happened. But thankfully, after like, you know, six months of being in that deletion belief, I came back to God and started to believe him again.

22:18 Speaker 3: But again, not as, as how much.

22:21 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's like, it's like, you know, I was over here and I went here and I'm back here.

22:26 Speaker 3: It's back to, okay, God, you exist. I believe you. It makes sense.

22:29 Speaker 5: Okay.

22:30 Speaker 3: But, you know, you stay there. I'll stay here. You don't interfere in my life. I don't interfere in yours. So yeah, that's what happened. Okay.

22:38 Speaker 2: So based on what you're saying, I think it's the fact that you encountered God, but you didn't take any step based on it. That's the point. It's like a lot of people... Like, oh, you know what I encountered? Like you said, you know, you meet a politician or you meet somebody popular, but you didn't take any step based on it. You know, like I was just reminded from the top of my head when you were just saying, like, for example, I met with Dr. Paul Denecron a couple of times. So that's how I got a contact.

23:07 Speaker 2: And what I use... If I didn't use that contact, I wouldn't have got his forward for my book, Unlead Your Purpose.

23:15 Speaker 5: Right?

23:15 Speaker 3: So.

23:16 Speaker 2: You have the contact that when you encounter God and he comes and tells you do this or do that. But if you're not taking a step based on it, it's going to be of no use. So, guys, that's why I always challenge you, you know, like no matter what. never neglect your time with the Lord. Like one of the things I always tell people is I deal with a lot of young people.

23:38 Speaker 5: I teach the kids in church and all of them.

23:41 Speaker 2: I say, you know, even if you can't read the typical King James version, obviously that's like Dawat and things like that, which you won't understand. Or even if you don't understand NIV version, there's versions in the Bible that, you know, are so apt for today's generation. I don't know if you've heard of something called the Gen Z version of the Bible.

24:02 Speaker 5: I do that.

24:04 Speaker 2: Because it just uses like God's love is on another level, dude. And, you know, God's lead it or something like that. So there's something called the Gen Z Bible. There's something else called Manga Bible, where you have the whole Bible in the form of a comic book. there's something called audio Bible, video Bible. So I tell people, you know, if you, you know, like in a typical case scenario, you know, if you ask people, you have to read the Bible, read the Bible, that's traditional approach, right?

24:28 Speaker 2: But I tell people that most of the people today don't like reading, you know, like they don't have time for reading. They don't like reading, you know, then how do you expect them to read the Bible? So I tell people, if you can't typically read the Bible, then read it or feed.

24:44 Speaker 5: On it in the format that works for you.

24:47 Speaker 3: Absolutely.

24:47 Speaker 5: You know what I mean?

24:48 Speaker 2: This is a thing that I always tell you people, right? Like in some form or the other, if you don't like NIV version, go for Gen Z version or go for the manga version. Or if you don't like reading at all, go for audio Bibles. If you're watching this podcast, that means you love watching something. Then go for video Bibles. So some format that works for you, as long as the word is getting on the inside of you. I think that's what will actually sustain you.

25:16 Speaker 5: I remember this.

25:17 Speaker 2: Scripture it says that the word of God sustained it says in the book of Jeremiah so in the sense like how you know you know I'm a crazy Scooby-Doo fan I'm a record holder for Scooby-Doo so here's Scooby-Doo now there's how when Scooby is scared or Scooby faces anything the first thing is like Scooby if you do it for a Scooby snacks so Scooby snacks changes Scooby from this scaredy cat to this brave guy who catches the ghost so same way our Scooby snacks is the word of God So the more we encounter him and keep feeding on him, that's how we'll actually see the difference in and through our life.

25:55 Speaker 1: You've been listening to Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta. We hope you were blessed and inspired to live the life that God has for you. Make sure to subscribe to the John Gifta YouTube channel for regular uploads of sermons, skits, interviews, and more. Follow John Gifta on Instagram for regular inspirational posts. and don't forget to check out the best-selling books written by John Gifta, Who Am I?, which will help you understand your identity, and the latest number one bestseller, Unveil Your Purpose, helping you discover your purpose and to start walking in it.

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