Skill vs Spirit-Led | John Giftah | Vivian Williams (Iconic Worship) Interview (Part 5)

0:01 Speaker 1: Do you ever look around and think, Wow, the world is a crazy place and it just seems to get crazier and crazier. Ease your mind and take a break. This is Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta. We're a hub for inspirational Christian sermons, practical keys for Christian living, and Christian discussions and interviews. You'll be inspired to live the life that you were created for. Your host is a top ranking podcaster, best selling author, world record holder, aerospace engineer, life coach, evangelist and founder of John Gifta International.

0:41 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta.

0:49 Speaker 2: But as he was saying that each of us have something different, what are the things that's unique to you? Is the fact that you have a sales background. I think you Oldiest mentioned about this. I think that is something that added value to you, even in terms of using it in the iconic worship. And I love this because you know, when I started out, I started got showed me about marketing in the Bible A lot. I'm an engineer, but a lot of marketing.

1:16 Speaker 3: Stuff absolutely on that.

1:18 Speaker 2: Yeah. So, like, for example, when you think about David getting the opportunity to defeat Goliath. You know he said, I defeated the lion and the bad What was that he was saying? You know, these are my past successes. He was marketing himself. Or when we think about the cup batter going to the Pharaoh and telling about Joseph, he was like, you know what, he was his first client or customer. He had success with Joseph, Andiguez goes and tells somebody else. You know, it's like word of mouth marketing.

1:47 Speaker 2: So you see marketing or all of these things we think as worldly, worldly terms, but we can use all of that to bless people. You can use all of that in ministry. So do you have a face this thing where you know what this is something you can use, like even in terms of my ministry right my podcast right now, I took a break and I'm restarting this. But back in the day, it was the number one and the Christianity in India. I don't know if you knew about it, the ranking if you say so, Uh, that's how I was able to interview a lot of people like and all all of yeah, one thousand episodes.

2:24 Speaker 2: The reason I used to project that even now, if you see on my Instagram. One of the things that have pinned is the podcast ranking is not to boast, you know what I mean?

2:34 Speaker 3: Like, the one of the.

2:35 Speaker 2: Reasons I paused was, of course there was a technical issue, but the other point was where I need to show God that my idol, my podcast was not my idol. My rankings were not my idle. I was like, God, even if i lose everything, it's okay if if I'm at peace with you, you know what I mean, Like, I had to get to that place. But the reason I project that is not to boast, but rather in a marketing quite a few like even my book becoming number one best seller, I use it only to project because if you say it's a best seller, people were like, oh, let me check it out, or you know, something like that.

3:10 Speaker 2: So you can use it in the right way, but not for self grati glorification, but so that it will draw mento as card. Now, so on a similar note, how do you draw that balance using sales but at the same time you're not doing it in the wrong unethical way or something like that.

3:27 Speaker 4: I truly believe if when it comes to the growth aspect, growth aspect only the growth aspect, not the profit aspect. But if churches and ministries are run like startup companies, it'd be somewhere else today. I actually believe, you know, the growth aspects of how they use social media to grow, how they use digital ads to grow, how they prioritize few things like you rightly said, marketing and sales.

3:59 Speaker 3: Right I believe.

4:00 Speaker 4: Jesus was the best salesman in the world. You know, one of the principles and sales is always questioning. You know our answer. You always question Jesus. He did that very thing he answered. He always questioned. The coolest thing was when the Phariseason and Sara Dices were I think, being a fight with them, and Jesus said, there was this man who couldn't walk. He looked to the Pharisees and Sara season until told which is easier to say, get up and walk?

4:28 Speaker 3: All sins if we're given Yeah, you know so.

4:33 Speaker 4: I think even in our freedom evening, eighty percent of our usual audience went on a long weekend, so we didn't have the audience, and we projecting and telling five hundred people are going to come find it, are going to come.

4:48 Speaker 3: We don't know how many people will show up.

4:51 Speaker 4: And on freedom evening before that, like I think three days before that, we went to the we went to Church Street and we held a pluck card which said happy hours force four pm pm.

5:09 Speaker 3: Okay, we're holding this pluckards, come talk to us. And that's why all.

5:14 Speaker 4: The people who had drinking problem, drinking habit and usual people they came and they said what is this about? Mm hmmm, and uh, you know, I don't know. I'm interested in this. What is happy hours? So usually it's that time wearing it cheap alcohol and I know I know. So we're like, okay, before we tell you about that, why do you think it's called happy hours? We ask them a question against sales, and then they're like, it's because it's free alcohol.

5:44 Speaker 3: Is because we forgot our problems for three four hours? Awesome?

5:47 Speaker 4: You want to get to that? We want to answer, do you want to? So we asked the next question, do you want to forget your problems or do you want solution to your problems?

5:58 Speaker 3: Wow?

5:59 Speaker 4: They're like, so what if I told you there's a place where it can encounter something so beautiful and you might have a solution to your problems? Who would be interested? Then you tell them about premiumly, can you give them a caution? Yes, this is missing gospel songs and everything, but it's open to all instre to shine. Then we sell them a ticket. And these are like people of different faith who buy tickets. We're happy with what you're doing, who feel good with what they're doing, they buy their tickets.

6:30 Speaker 3: You know.

6:31 Speaker 4: So when it comes to growth aspects, I mean when I was when I was CEO of the company, had a lot of people work under me.

6:41 Speaker 3: Over there.

6:42 Speaker 4: Also, I didn't know coding, I didn't know designing. Oh here, I don't know singing, I don't know. I just managing people. So those skills. Two years I understood how to work with people, how to get work done, how to make people see a vision. Yeah you know all of those things. And yeah, those same things. Thankfully, you know, God's been trained me over there. God is using me o way here.

7:13 Speaker 2: Okay, but how do you balance between following what you call as a sales strategy versus like spiritalt like in the sense what I mean is sometimes being on YouTube for example, Okay, this is a constant thing that happens. Now, let's say there was this quote unquote something you know, like wokeness that happened in Olympics, for example, right like last year and twenty four. So if I were to use the Olympic thing, you know, I can go viral if I use that. But at the same time, as an individual, or let's take a recent example, right there was this pastor who quote unquote was caught into some sexual thing and stuff like that.

7:54 Speaker 2: So the minute anybody posted anything with that past's name, you know, would get a lot of views. And if I could use it to get views, I could have done it easily. But then I just can't do that. But I would come to a place where like, let's pray for so and so, you know, let's have this perspective, let's have this so you know, it's like a thin line between you know, making sure you're not just trying to be like the world, trying to use that tool just to get views, but you're making sure that you're guiding people to us the right path, even if it means it hurts your channel.

8:31 Speaker 2: Like for me as a YouTuber on YouTube, it hurts the channel because if somebody comes in, like they want to expect you to bash that pastor, they would love to watch that video, but when they realize you're saying, let's have a different perspective. Let's they're not going to watch for long. It hurts the view, it hurts the retention.

8:49 Speaker 4: One thing is I would never build my success on someone else's.

8:55 Speaker 3: Stimulation exactly, so we can't do that principles.

8:59 Speaker 4: For example, today, what if you for the name of getting viral, if you're sorry to say, like if you're what you say, if you can get into any nonsense today, yes, a lot of nonsense. But our mission, our goal is not just to get viral, because there a lot of people who are viral, yes, have no influence exactly, no insluence, who are not building the kingdom. So everything has to have that perfect balance.

9:25 Speaker 2: But that's why my prayer has always been, like God, more than viral. My focus is on impact, you know, like whether it gets viral or not that second, but then the impact somebody watching that they should get leave with something, you know, even if it's Sometimes the weirdest of videos do well for me. Recently, I think I posted about there was some very weird video like I don't know if you checked it out, like of me just my body. I mean, no, what is that?

9:58 Speaker 3: I said?

9:58 Speaker 2: My soul is leaving my body. It was this a weird graphic. I just posted that, and then I've posted like if you are you willing to meet Jesus if you died or something like that, and it led to a lot of people asking a lot of questions. Even in my workplace, people were like, you know, asking about life after death. There were people who send me messages like I'm really confused, what about this? And then I also directed them to one of the interviews I did with past John Burke is an expert in near that experiences, so that you know, like that is what I really feel should be the focus, right, like not just being viral, but how can you lead them to think or transform them, leave them better?

10:39 Speaker 2: You know, even this conversation, that's how every aspect I wanted to make sure that you know it people leave like even if they are going to watch segments of this interview, they should learn something out of it.

10:52 Speaker 3: You know.

10:52 Speaker 2: That's the heart behind this whole.

10:55 Speaker 1: You've been listening to Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta. I hope you were blessed and inspired to live the life that God has for you. Make sure to subscribe to the John Gifta YouTube channel for regular uploads of sermons, skits, interviews, and more. Follow John Gifta on Instagram for regular inspirational posts, and don't forget to check out the best selling books written by John Gifta, Who Am I which will help you understand your identity and the latest number one best seller Unveil Your Purpose, helping you discover your purpose and to start walking in it.

11:30 Speaker 1: Make sure to leave a rating and review, and be sure to share it with your friends and loved ones. If you'd like to donate, you can find the PayPal link in the description, and if you'd like to invite John Gifta to speak at your event or to get more details, go to the website at www godjohngifted dot com. See you on the next episode of The Fuel for the Soul with John Gifta. God Bless you